The majority of estate agents surveyed by Eye who are already committed to OnTheMarket say they will be listing with Rightmove under the “one other portal”rule.
This rule, requiring OnTheMarket agents to list their properties with only one other portal, effectively means that most agents will have to decide between the existing two giants, Rightmove and Zoopla.
In today’s second part of Eye’s portal survey, we look further at the 1,094 responses to the questions asked about Agents’ Mutual’s OnTheMarket portal, launching on January 26.
Please note that the responses came from firms, not offices.
In answer to the question: Have you already committed to join AM/OTM?
42.1% (461) said YES
57.86% (633) said NO
We then analysed the 461 who said they have committed to join OnTheMarket
In answer to the question: After the launch of OnTheMarket, under their “one other portal” rule, which other portal will you list with (answered by 460)
23.04% (106) said ‘Not yet decided’
60.43% (278) said Rightmove
12.39% (57) said Zoopla
1.3% (6) said Primelocation*
2.83% (13) said ‘Other’
* Primelocation comes within the Zoopla package.
From these responses, it appears that of firms which say in our survey that they are already committed to OnTheMarket, significantly more are intending to list with Rightmove than with Zoopla.
However, we should point out that at this stage, these are probably only indications of intent, as some agents may not have given notice, and therefore it may not be a true reflection of what actually takes place at the point of action.
* The Eye property portal survey was a totally independent exercise. It was not commissioned by any portal or other business, and only Eye had any input into it.
Comments (112)
I've just read all of these comments… So in the last five minutes I've just signed up! From now on I'm no longer 'a fence sitter…' I feel quite liberated!
Mr Rowe – glad to hear you're now hanging loose and well and truly 'over the fence' – but don't forget you'll need to change your website "Services" information PDQ! ;o)
Luckily it's a two second job and has been added to the long list of other marketing material that needs to be changed, PeeBee 😉
This just proves my industry is full of idiots – we are handing a massive gift to RM. This weakening of Zoopla will ultimately give RM a stronger monopoly (especially with their current marketing budget over OTM).
We were looking good until the weak decided they couldn't do without an RM listing – we are now doomed.
I am not weak because I haven't cancelled RM for OTM, just sensible and following business logic instead of anti RM and Z emotion. Where is the business sense in cancelling RM before OTM has established any credentials? If ever there was a case of putting the cart before the horse this would be it. AM have made a fatal mistake with the one portal rule.
Personally I don't think AM have made a mistake. If I was in charge, I would drop the "one other portal rule" as soon as possible AFTER securing a good footing.
I'm sorry, Taff – but you have lost me completely on that one. I thought the whole idea of the 'one other portal' rule was to ensure that OTM IS a success in its' aims to beat the competition, and not just be 'one of the pack'?
It probably was, BUT when OTM becomes successful (not if IMO) personally I would let members advertise on any website they like – but why would you WANT to advertise on another site if your own was successful. Dropping the "one other portal" rule though would make a good political statement and show that we were strong enough to stand on our own 2 feet and compete with anybody.
This has been a thrilling debate to follow over the past 12 months. There is still very little news about this in the open press. The aim to disrupt the portals is something we won't know if it has worked for some time. It has certainly disrupted the inner circle of Estate Agents.
The key to RM success is not it advertises properties, it is because agents promoted its web site. The key to OTM or any other portal success is for agents to do the same again. As being seen Z are now suffering as agents start to pull the plug and the same can happen to RM once OTM or any other web site becomes dominant. It is not the public that drives a web portal to success it is the estate agent that feed it and this is the main reason why the stock market is so very very worried.
Agents promoting RM in our shop windows etc., have IMO been a very small part of their success. By far the biggest factor has been that they were the first property sale portal and advertised massively for years to get where they are now. It takes huge constant advertising to establish a brand name nationally and it is even more difficult to get people to remember your name and regularly visit your website. The dotcom crash proved that. The amount of people who look in our shop windows and see the logos we display are a tiny fraction of those who visit RM and Z and IMO it won't be the amount of stock on OTM that drives traffic to the site it will be the amount of advertising. Z had the same problem and despite outspending RM by x3 over the past 3/4 years they still lag way behind in 2nd place. I understand the sentiment behind OTM and the passion it raises but logic tells me, as others have said, that all AM will succeed in doing is making RM even stronger and more smug than it is now.
But "advertising" takes different forms. Joe Public won't have to think hard when the link directly to OTM will be included in every single property e-mail etc I send out. I've said it before, but the COLLECTIVE advertising we have is huge and I for one will be playing my part.
Hi Woodentop – I agree all the way to the finish line and back with you on your first sentence. The problem as I have seen it is now that these two big animals have grown (due to the incessant feeding and petting by us, their 'masters') – and getting the attention of the public away from them will be difficult to say the least and possibly COST more in lost revenue than any 'saving' that some Agents hope to achieve – and until OTM is established it is, in my opinion, the main stumbling block with me, as I have maintained from day 1. BUT… I potentially stand to be corrected come January onwards – and like many, would welcome that possibility.
Hello PeeBee. For me the siting on the fence is a personal call, which I respect but I have to say all the doubters and there are only a handful posting on Eye. Excluding those that work for RM &Z or web only agents who will not be allowed on OTM have never actually come up with why it will not work and have everything to achieve by not making it work. BUT all I hear from them is it will not work , not why. The reason is that OTM is no different to RM as a web portal. If it wins or fails will be down to the high agents adopting it. Advertising in one office makes no difference but collectively is the way forward and that is how RM got going and is not rocket science for another portal to do the same. TV advertisng by RM & Z is a spattering once in a while and OTM can compete with that. I predict (neck on chopping block) that once any doubters see it up and running and how they can actually use it to their marketing benefit against those that don't use (as the corporates did with anyone not on RM) OTM will grow and grow over the 3 to 6 months of starting and will drop RM which will have out priced itself amongst other things that are wrong with the portal. I've said it before agents need to recognise their own market, work at it, plan and adapt to the change over with customers who always follow and don't be hindered by ghosts that are not there. Be positive one and all!
Woodentop – probably one of the most sensible and articulate arguments so far put forward for AM. They should employ you! In fairness (and credit where due), though, it is far more than just that.
Just for sport…….. Some contributors to this page / site do not feel that EYE is bias or pro towards AM just look at the stories headline "Most OTM agents in Eye survey will choose Rightmove as ‘one other portal’ why not word it as "Most Rightmove agents in Eye survey will choose OTM as one other portal" Considering RM is still the number 1 portal it would make sense.
I'm afraid the reason why so many won't join is down to the communist approach to the set up of AM. I don't mean to get in any way political about this but many of us small independents just don't trust the individual and the snooty group of agents that first set this up. I know the concept is all will be equal but as George Orwell once considered, under a supposedly equal regime some are still more equal than others! You won't convince me otherwise and I know from those I have discussed the AM concept with the vast majority of independents feel the same way. I should elaborate when I say the vast majority I have only discussed in detail with 6 others but 4 feel the same as I do. Under PIEs system of working out statistics that's about 67% of the market!
Heard a lot of arguments against AM, but not sure how anyone could consider Springett's £500k salary "communist"
@ jmeapps01….."many of us small independents just don't trust the individual and the snooty group of agents that first set this up."…..Why? and how many small independent agents are you referring to?……I don't suppose for 1 minute you can expand on this totally irrelevant, naïve, and incredibly stupid comment, also why "snooty"?…..what do you mean by that????? Is this the argument against OTM when all else fails???
I think I see the point……Just! – are you saying you do not believe in the one agent, one vote? I do have reservations about that myself but I certainly would not call the agents who started snooty. Market leading independent agents yes, out for there own good yes but not snooty.
(Letting agency) Advertising is always a bit hit and miss, a dark art. The costs have rocketed over the years. Set up own website and have high street office agencies. About 15 years ago we dropped Yellow pages, no impact saved loads. We then dropped all newspaper adverts about 7 years ago – no real/serious impact. but We went into FAP and Z found we were losing out to RM so dropped FAP/Z and just on RM now. Get good results as most of our clients go there first.
Love the idea of AM but dont want to increase our advertising costs again. Why would I want to pay more then I have to? We just let, no sales and have done so successfully for the last 30 years after doing both.
With AM if it is shown to me that we are losing out by not being on it then yes we would join but not at this stage. With AM saying to agents go with just one other and the majority are going with RM then as other posters have said RM will remain dominant. Will AM match RM in the future with properties? Hmmm not sure. Can AM survive as 2nd to RM? If i were running AM I would recognise that AM need to overtake RM at some stage to stay in the long game.
How will AM get agents to leave RM and get agencies like me to just be on AM? be more dominate then RM. So its a chicken and egg but as the chicken is already in the roost of RM its going take an awful to for me to switch. I dont want to spend any more then I have to.
It would have been interesting to ask the following question – Having selected your 1 Other Portal, are you considering leaving that portal during 2015? My answer – Yes! …and I suspect there will be many others opting to drop Rightmove, for me they are merely useful during the changeover period. I run a monthly contract with RM allowing me to exit when it suits me. I have avoided any bolt-ons and long term contracts as I wanted flexibility. My next task will be to persuade my surrounding/geographical agents to move collectively away from Rightmove… in reality we only need 1 Property Portal in the UK and I and many others have taken the first steps along that particular path… it's a sound business decision worth investing & fighting for… no one said it would be easy, however I'm in for the long haul.
"My next task will be to persuade my surrounding/geographical agents to move collectively away from Rightmove"….This for me is the crucial and most critical stage of this whole process. OTM already has the numbers and committed members for it to work and gain traction but for me the key point will be when and soon we can get to the "switch off point" for Rightmove. I believe that for some where the numbers are strongest (Scotland, the north east and South Wales for example) that point will come sooner, for others it may take a little bit longer. But for me this announcement today cements the fact that this day will come, the question is when.
@PaulH… Agreed, no question that many agents are looking towards the Switch Off Duopoly & Switch Fully On Agents Mutual. The thing I find odd is the comments on here from folks saying it will last 6 months etc etc….. Why?….. Why would RM & Zoop have the oportunity to grow their portals and Agents Mutual not? Don't kid yourself! UK Estate Agents must have realised by now that it is they that feed the Duopoly and all we simply have to do is move our Online Shop Window! …. ah, yes…. traction, the public, the leads, the number of hits, the boogie man!….! Hokum Pokum!…. UK Estate Agency is changing for the better!… better for agents, better for the public, better for the future of our industry! As I say, no one said it would be easy as we have The Duopoly fighting for their financial lives however it still remains the case that estate agents are tasked with choosing how to market/sell property and that includes how/where it is marketed online. Thing is… pre-portal?… there were none!.. now we have The Duopoly and no one else can provide a UK Property Portal?!… nonsense! OnTheMarket.com 26/01/15.
You can start by weakening rightmove.co.uk after the 26th January, just removed all your rightmove.co.uk logos off any literature and newspaper advertisements. I've just thrown all the latest rightmove.co.uk literature in the bin. We will use the onthemarket.com literature instead. Probably be like getting someone off drugs (the viewing public I mean), it will be slow process. But if we all do this and onthemarket.com is a good website, the public don't care as long as they can be pointed to find properties they require. People don't move that often, so they will just accept what is the recommended website at that time.
The 'switch off point' as you call it, can only work if we all work together. And it will take time. As I've said before, we all made rightmove.oc.uk the number one website and we can change it to 🙂
Any bad English sorry due to dyslexia
rightmove.oc.uk should be rightmove.co.uk (here the proof about the dyslexic bit) 🙂
In a nutshell, this bickering is getting no-one anywhere fast. The survey is not indicative of the industry only those that are using Eye. No-one knows what will happen come January with those sitting on the fence and as for RM long term, well the question was loaded and that was not asked, how many will then drop RM when they see OTM works.
Have to agree with you on this. The eye runs the risk of becoming a "1 trick pony" if it simply relies on the "OTM story" = 100 + similar daily comments model, then same again next day, and so on. I appreciate it is the "hot" story….but how many angles can you get??. It's a website at the end of the day where about 4,500 offices will advertise their property for at least the next 5 years..that's the facts…. I know that other headlines might not get as much comment but there must be other important industry news worthy of a headline? Please?
Yes, all the big stories are on another site: mansion tax, Stella Creasy, stamp duty reform, Ed Balls. Best go there.
Despite Simon's post I am not sure there was a promotion to drop Z, its fair to say I don't like everything on their site, but actually I would have preferred to have seen agents coming of RM. But the fact is, that in many areas in the south and thats all I can comment on, this was always likely to be the result. Do I see it as good news, not really, but whether you agree with OTM or not, its going to happen, therefore what we see above is a situation all agents have to recognise. As I see it, come the end of January, we will have one massive market leader RM and two smaller ones OTM and Z, so the question is commercially, will agents who perhaps aren't really wanting to leave Z, join OTM anyway because the result of not doing so does give RM a scary amount of control. The reason I don't suggest that agents would come off OTM and go back to Z is they can't, well not for 5 years at least. Additionally, although a few of the extreme anti OTM will no doubt disagree, in many areas the market leaders are joining OTM and lets be frank about it, this was the only reason any portal became a success, agents constantly try and equal out their market place by offering the same things.
Despite my post? I realise I am influential but even I can't go back in time (yet)!
Ok well lets agree on "despite the insinuation made in….."
Simon, why are you so troubled with the concept that it can't be a flop? The numbers and contractual obligation for 5 years means that as a business, irrespective of what happens to the property market, whatever Alan Kyeda or the Oxford rowing team do, the bills are covered. You might not like or respect what Ian Springett has done but he has won! Game set and match. Whether or not OTM becomes part of the new duopoly or whether it is the not pink propertylive is yet to be seen, but for the next 5 years OTM is here and Ian's wages are paid. Well done him!
The funny thing is if you had left off the final paragraph that was probably a very good attempt at an intelligent post.
Thanks Benjay, I think… Praise aside, I hear your point and it is as usual an enigma wrapped up in a paradox! However, I think we are closer than you realise. It's all about how you define 'flop' to me, important though the issue may be, Ian Soringett's ability to draw his wages for five years does not constitute success, in my book anyway. By the way Ian, how much are you getting paid, someone posted £500K, surely not? In a perverse way, AM is likely to be a raging success for the agents that don't join, 'feeding frenzy' is a phrase that come to mind 🙂
What do your fellow directors and advertisers think of you posting on here Simon? Isn't the enigma/paradox thing more descriptive of you now spending your days on here?
Shush, I haven't told them, I suppose it is a bit of a paradox, or heart versus head, which sits badly with the conspiracy theorists but like Baldrick, maybe I have a 'cunning plan'
You don't have a cunning plan Simon, you are purely reactive. The fact you are posting on here is a reaction to the failure of EAT to attract a single comment on any of the stories currently on page 1. An industry news channel/ forum that isn't attracting comment isn't one likely to attract advertisers. The big difference about you posting on here and posting on EAT? no-one care, you have no influence and have no enforced authority or resect. You can't break EYE like you did EAT and will simply attract ridicule. You carry on mate, if this is a plan Ricky Gervais might be interested in a script.
Since we are too close to the situation here, let's use a metaphor to help distance ourselves. Google is Rightmove. Bing is Zoopla. Yahoo is PrimeLocation (Bing powers Yahoo). OK. Now let's assume that the government went off to start it's own website: xyz.co.uk, but if you were a website you could only show up on xyz.co.uk plus either Google or Bing (+Yahoo). Now let's assume everyone does the logical thing and either a) doesn't join xyz.co.uk at all or b) joins and keeps Google as the other provider, as it is more dominant. Now please ask yourselves, answering truthfully as you possibly can, how many of you would go to xyz.co.uk to do your searching knowing that 1) it won't have all the results and 2) Google WILL have all the results and 3) 70%+ of you probably already use Google as your sole search provider. PLEASE wake up and come to your senses!
Great analogy. But if Google were charging 4 times more than xyz.co.uk, and had publicly announced their intention to further increase their charges ad infinitum, yet xyz.co.uk had fixed their charges for five years, and everyone using them were also promoting them with gusto, it is likely that xyz.co.uk would gather more and more supporters until they were strong enough to allow customers to switch off their supply of data to Google completely. This would eventually weaken Google until they had to bring their charges down to a justifiable level. Note: no one wants Google to go out of business… Thats how it works in my view. The speed with which all this happens is entirely driven by the customers who must decide for themselves how long they want to be paying too much for their internet presence.
Fair enough, but you have to think of this sequentially. 1) xyz.co.uk launches, with some (but not full) support and 1a) supporters drop Bing, but not Google. 2) The general population continues along their merry way using Google as they always have. Those who used to use Bing or Yahoo either continue as is or get dissatisfied with a lack of results and switch to Google (remember, xyz.co.uk has only a fraction of the results of Google, so why would you use it just yet?) 3) xyz.co.uk has now captured the #2 spot in terms of listings but still has no traffic. So now, your choice becomes to either pay increasingly high rates to put your listing on Google, whom EVERYONE uses, or to pay pennies to put it on xyz.co.uk, who virtually NO ONE uses. If everyone else is on Google you will be too.
Best answer here so far
Honestly, do you really believe the public care a jot how much Google charge the businesses that appear on the searches?
You have to pay to advertise & you pay more to advertise in places with a bigger reach. Quite why this industry doesn't understand that is beyond me, and will be beyond your vendors. Who, by the way, aren't loyal to you or your business (agents, not Robin specifically), but are loyal to who will sell their house most quickly and for the most money.
I think a few are in for a shock. Remember – the public don't like estate agents very much.
Who DO the public like? Firemen – you never hear a bad word about firemen? Nurses – Salt of the earth – God bless em. Soldiers – where would we be without the good old British squaddie eh? Common link – the public pay ****** all for any of them DIRECTLY. If the public had a bill when they went to A&E, or a bill for pulling their ***** out of a tree or a bill on your mat from the MoD there would be ****** uproar.
Here's a better analogy: OTM is the child and RM is the comfort blanket. As said child grows & develops, the comfort blanket is no longer needed. Can it be made any clearer?
OK. But said child will never "grow" if no one ever goes to the website, which they will have no reason to ever do if it has half the inventory in the market and Rightmove has all of it.
Ah but Zoopla was once that child and grew!
"If no one ever goes to the website", you make a comment like that and expect a serious reply? Jog on.
Sorry, "no one" was a little strong, I apologise Mr. Pundit. You will certainly be there checking out your listings! But honestly, if an ordinary (i.e. not affiliated with the property industry) consumer wants to check out properties, will he go to the site he has been using for the last ten years that he knows has all the properties on it, or will he go to the one that some scummy estate agent told him to use that when he tried once only had about half the number of properties? Yeah, now that I think about it, I'm pretty much willing to stand by the "no one" comment.
Sorry neither of these metaphors work…….Google support free listing and you pay to put your advert in the shop window that comparison is more like PIE (Google) EAT (Bing) BBC (XYZ) content drives readers, adverts provide monetisation. The baby one is also simply. If you do not feed a baby it doesn't grow.
Since when has 60% been "all the results"?
OK there is a point that I need to make here. Those of you (like Paul H) who think this is the first step to the downfall of Rightmove need to consider the following: THERE DO NOT NEED TO BE TWO PORTALS. Right now there are, because Zoopla is a legitimate contender. But in markets like Australia, or Germany, there is one dominant player, and then there are lots of start-up wannabe portals who no one visits and are largely irrelevant. We have those same portals here. We also have had numerous "real" challengers to the Duopoly here over the years, all of whom ended up relegated to that camp of wannabes. The only reason that OTM had any chance of succeeding was that it would split the inventory between RM and ZPG, leaving each with an incomplete view of the total property industry. But if everyone chooses to leave ZPG, think for a second what happens. The exclusivity rule that was the calling card for OTM all of a sudden becomes irrelevant, because now there is only one competitor: RM. And RM has all the properties, and RM is no weaker than it was yesterday, except that that pesky "real contender" is now gone. And then do you know what happens ladies and gentlemen? OTM goes the way of the dodo bird because it's effectively a RM with a worse website and a far lower marketing budget, leaving the UK in the same place as Australia: one dominant portal, and a lot of pretenders (which now will include both ZPG AND OTM).
I couldn't agree more with the above. The 'only one other portal' has strengthened Rightmove even further as it appears it is Rightmove plus 1.
This has got me thinking, what would happen if Rightnove brought out a 'no other portal' policy? Just a thought…
They would be investigated by the regulators for anticompetitive behaviour, obviously. Or was that supposed to be a rhetorical question?
It was rhetorical! I might have been in this industry too long and become too cynical. From being upbeat about OTM 12 months ago, all I see now is agents paying lip service to OTM whilst strengthening and backing Rightmove much more. It would be interesting to see all those backing OTM, if it came down to OTM or Rightmove, which would they choose!
Clipped RM wings I suspect for driving up fees.
I partly agree with you uk, I would say there is an argument that we only need one and further I believe in the short term RM will get stronger. Z invested massively to gain market, they offered hugely discounted rates to get some agents on board and they nearly got there but in my opinion they were only ever there by virtue of the stronger housing market. If that had changed significantly, OTM aside they would have lost huge market anyway. There is a difference with OTM and that it is an industry driven portal. Its commercial interests are different, whilst that doesn't mean overnight it will topple RM, I do believe that if it gets to the same position as Z is now, and that I believe has been done primarily over the last 24 months, then I think it would have the support from agents to go the rest of the way.
On the other hand OTM will have already replaced Zoopla as the number 2, rather than sitting on the sidelines as the "number 3 portal"
Read my post above. It's currently #3 behind a strong #2. Sure it may become #2 by tearing down the current #2, but that doesn't accomplish anything, since tearing down ZPG doesn't make OTM any stronger. If no one goes to the website you won't get any leads, and if it sits there for a year or two with agents getting no return on their investment and no forward momentum, agents will start to leave (5-year contract? What will they do? Sue you? Remove your properties? Get real).
People will go to the website though, as it will be seen as the number 2 and will take visitors from Zoopla. There is no brand loyalty, the portal that has the properties and a good layout will win overall.
As established yesterday both Zoopla and Rightmove don't have a rate card they simply charge as much as they can get away with and this survey leads you to believe that OnTheMarket will become the second portal even sooner than many of us anticipated. Brilliant news and bad news for Rightmove who would rather have a non agent owned portal to compete and raise prices along side as opposed to OTM who have kept fees at the same level for 5 years. RM will be wary about raising fees to those agents on OTM whilst those who want to wait and see will jump on board much sooner knowing that OTM is the second portal and by being on board you hold a much stronger negotiating hand if RM ever try to raise your fees. The exclusivity rule has clearly proven to be a massive factor in the success of this project so far!
Paul, I cannot help while reading your post wondering if you have lost your sanity. This in no way, shape, or form is a bad thing for Rightmove. If you think so I'd suggest you make your way to your local practitioner posthaste. And, I would note, as an extension of this NOT being a bad thing for Rightmove, this is also NOT a good thing for those of us here.
It's certainly a good thing for RM short term but who knows what will happen long term. We have signed up to OTM and have given notice to Zoopla, with the intent of using RightMove as our "other choice". The problem there is, as the article shows, we will be throwing more money at RM which is against the whole reason why OTM is here. Long term, if RM keep their stupid pricing structure and keep jacking up the fees it won't be long before agents stop and think about leaving for just OTM.
This won't happen – agents won't hand that competitive advantage to their competition (even for the long-term benefit).
ukpropmaster – Good luck trying to even get a balanced view from Paul, He is the poster boy for AM!
Smile Please – I've actually added some opinion and reasoning in to my post as opposed to your snidy jibe. I've never denied the fact that Rightmove may well gain in the short term, but for me this has always been a long term venture and I genuinely believe that the sooner OTM is number 2 portal the sooner more agents will jump on board which will bring OTM close to it's main objective. Snidy comments aside I do enjoy reading most of your balanced posts perhaps we will see more going forward.
Time now to approach Rightmove, Zoopla or both, make it clear you are with OTM, and for them, if they really want to compete for your business they must offer you a better and more attractive deal for them to retain you. The control and your future is now at last moving back into our hands. Thank you OTM.
"Time now to approach Rightmove, Zoopla or both, make it clear you are with OTM, and for them, if they really want to compete for your business they must offer you a better and more attractive deal for them to retain you. " A bit late in the day to be making it clear to them now surely? And good luck trying to negotiate with RM; we were just told it was going to be a £35 – £50 a month per branch increase. Take it or leave it.
This is interesting in that it reflects the core AM group message of 'drop Zoopla' which effectively means 'strenghen Rightmove' a bizarre strategy with the ironic outcome of helping to re-establish the monopoly the movement set out to destroy. The majority of Estate Agents who have rejected AM are not going to be happy if this leads to even more aggressive price increases next year, I see a anti AM agent backlash in the firm of extreme 'target marketing' starting now (Spicer Haart take note). It's all a great shame and a missed opportunity. The industry could have had its own open portal representing a broad base of companies, uniting everyone into a growing force. Instead we have the Arcane AM which is at best a niche player whose biggest achievement has been to polarise the industry and bring it under the negative scrutiny of the main stream press and the authorities. My bet is still that the whole thing flops badly, I think this survey will help that process considerably.
Oh, dear. Content asdide for a moment – I haven't had a caffeine injection so will leave that for a while – but Mr Shinerock is seemingly another poster who feels the need to 'Like' his own posts. (useful hint – Log Out and 'Like' it again – that way you double your own self-satisfaction AND the total number of 'Likes' you will receive, Mr Shinerock…)
Em, pee bee- It appears Simon has actually taken something you've said on board…..
Noted, I only did it because no one else does
OMG, I have support!!!
Yeah, well… with all those staff to order to press the button I'd not be crowing that only six (five, if you took my earlier advice…) did what you told them to do…
PeeBee, sadly my staff don't get up that early (joking guys)
🙂
You don't need to know why Nan but every time my name appears on this website click on the thumb, remember to get Nancy, Ethel, George, Doris and Eric to do the same or there'l be no Rich Tea with your Elevenses. Oh Eric has passed on you say? I suppose that was a release, you'll make sure the relatives don't take the Ipad won't you? I'll be needing that for the next resident, any news who it might be?
Could everyone please re-set their routers- Simon wants us to get up to 50 likes by 11 and we have run out of IP addresses.
He NEARLY made it I see, Benay – must have a router or two set to 'Static IP'… ;o)
I've just given Simon a like, only 1 away now.
Feeling generous, Paul H – or has Mr Shinerock posted something… a 'first'… that you are actually prepared to agree with? Spill the beans, Sir! ;o)
Blimey pee bee…..over double figures on "likes"…..probably a new record for you……..and there's me thinking you didn't approve of self liking?
Eh? Where? SINGLE figures is considered an achievement for me, matey! ;o)
Oh… now I see it. Hah – thirteen – my lucky number! But I can absolutely assure you, wilko – not ONE of them – or any of my previous unexpected 'Likes' – have been as a result of my mouse activities! ;o)
Simon- I chose this login name in no small part due to posters like you…and in large part due to you.
There appears to be a consensus that you have a vested interest in Zoopla.
As such your relentless tirade against AM is just an insult to the intelligence of the posters on this forum.
You have already reduced your own online forum to toilet paper status that few want to read, maybe it's time to re-assess your own importance and bow out.
Maybe and maybe I'm right, we shall see
Hmm….I think you missed the point. Financial interest warps impartial debate. This forum should be for impartial parties to debate matters. You can play the thick skinned punter all you like but you've done your brands no favours. Yes reply and have the last word if you really must…
From the Collins Dictionary
Impartial adjective
not prejudiced towards or against any particular side or party; fair; unbiased
LOL
Congratulations Simon- your apparent need to have the (rather confused) last word below not only proves the point but also further elucidates what you are about. Plenty of other words in the dictionary you should look up.
No -you are definitely and unequivocally WRONG on this. Not long to wait for you to be put out of your misery.
I think you hit the nail on the head HI, these guys are here because their ego's demand a wider audience. I suspect we will see a number of them now setting their alarm clocks to get their posts in early.
Actually, let's exolore your arguement a bit more, I like doing this when people make comments like yours, it amuses me. So what you are saying is that because I am pro Zoopla it means my anti AM position is invalid. Well, that's like saying that because someone is pro democracy their anti facist views are invalid. I hope you get your head around this concept, it will help clarify your thinking. And by the way, from a commercial point of view I'm pro me and pro my interests, I make no secret of that and I suspect any business person who says otherwise. However, my position on Zoopla is not determined by my feelings or interests whatsoever, my position is determined by logic, pure and simple. Instead of having a go at me personally, I challenge you, or anyone who shares your views to address the points I have made here today and in the past articles I have written which, by the way have been read over 100,000 times. Finally you have a go at EAT but you have to remember we have a few dozen posters on this issue and the industry is, in the main a silent majority. In the short run this topic is a beauty but looking at the longer game, I don't think so. I will now like this post
Twice, it seems. Nice to see that I've helped double your pleasure, Mr Shinerock.
I think Simon is a little aggressive and I do not agree with all his points (or news channel) but he does make a point that I wish others would take on board just because you don't agree with one, two or a number of thoughts of his does not mean he is always wrong. I think Simon (today at least) has put some thought into his reasons and shared them. I would say shame on you if you cannot at least appreciate a thought out argument instead of the blind opinion and passionate post from some members just hoping and following a promised dream. Yesterday a "Pro AM" poster put reason behind there choice for AM and was refreashing to hear some logic behind it and did make me think more on the subject.
smile please – I couldn't agree more that alternative views to our own should not be dismissed for that reason alone. People are entitled to an opinion and thanks to previous generations who fought for 'freedom' we all have a right to express them (on most subjects, that is…). Unfortunately, personal and business agendas get embroiled in these things and I would suggest this be the case here. From what he states above, Mr Shinerock has a vested interest in 'protecting' Z's status, and it appears that for whatever reason he can't or won't join AM – so it could be construed that he has gone out on an Anti-AM offensive to try to fortify his position with the other portal. That's fine – but he has to accept that if he chucks rocks he will get a few pinged back at him. I like the scars that the rocks have carved on me – they add a certain je ne sais quoi to the subtle resemblance to George Clooney. VERY subtle…
"I challenge you, or anyone who shares your views to address the points I have made here today and in the past articles I have written which, by the way have been read over 100,000 times."
Hmmm… I LOVE statistics. Have the every day for breakfast, lunch and tea. Let's have a taste and see if these will satisfy my inconsiderable hunger…
ARTICLE #1: Number of 'reads' – 89295. EH??????? I think your counter had a moment there, Mr Shinerock but never mind we will leave you thinking it is correct for the moment. Article #2: Number of reads – 8504. Better… but still unlikely. Article #3: Number of reads – 5388. People getting a bit tired now, perhaps? Article #4: Number of reads 3638. The Shine has deffo worn off at this point. SO… together these do indeed add up to 106,825 'reads'. A MIGHTY result by any standards. Assuming, of course, the numbers are 'real' – which, for the purposes of this exercise, we will assume they are. POSTS: Article #1 – 29 (0.0325 post per 'read'); Article #2 – 61 (0.712 ppr); Article #3 – 54 (1.00 ppr – CONGRATULATIONS – single figures at last!); Article #4 – 32 (0.88 ppr – single figures didn't last long…).
BUT here's the thing, Mr Shinerock. The post counts of articles #2, #3 and #4 were bolstered somewhat by a certain individual who needed the last word. That would be YOU, of course. 31% of the posts in Article #2 were yours; you posted 35% of those in Article #3 – and you hogged 37.5% of the column inches in Article #4.
Yup – I LIKE those stats. I'm full as a gun. Thank you, Mr Shinerock for my morning treat. ;o)
Oh – the "few dozen posters" referred to above is usually single figures, Sir – on EAT at least – which currently attracts single figures of posts in a week – INCLUDING the spammers. It must seem all a bit 'busy' for you here. I'm sure that EAT is more your comfort zone – what with your… how did you describe it – oh, yes – "declared investment interest" in it and all that.
Just as well, I guess, that you seem to be the kind of guy who can start an argument in an empty room…
Not up to your usual standard 5/10 must do better. You are only having a go at me because you agree with my core arguements. I'm sad you lot decided to abandon EAT but as I have said, there is a bigger picture to consider, ie the post AM landscape. I think it's fair to say you guys didn't so much abandon EAT as follow Ros, well there are two pubs now and you are welcome back at the other one any time you choose. Sadly the only articles currently getting significant posts relate to AM and this currently flatters this pub.
"You are only having a go at me because you agree with my core arguements." Sorry – bounce that one across me again, please? From where I stand, YOUR "core arguements" appear to be borrowed cut'n'pastes of issues I raised some time before your particular penny dropped on the matter – but of course we like to all claim to be the originator of something, don't we?
"…as I have said, there is a bigger picture to consider, ie the post AM landscape." Yes – but YOUR "bigger picture" and MINE are taken with different cameras, at different angles and with different filters – and THAT is where we differ vastly.
"I think it's fair to say you guys didn't so much abandon EAT as follow Ros…" The thing is, Mr Shinerock, the Landlord often either makes or breaks a pub. If the Landlord sets out to offend all the existing clientele then they let their feet do the talking. And without the 'regulars' sitting inside, partaking in the occasional milk stout and packet of crisps, then the bar looks and feels empty so it is hard to repopulate it – and you know how hard it is to flog a pub as a going concern these days…
If I borrowed/stole your arguments it still means we agree because you are agreeing with yourself. But coming back to the Landlord issue, firstly I am not the Landlord, or shouldn't be and secondly, you were all going to follow Ros anyway, at least for a while. I accept we have a task ahead of us to get a decent amount of posts back on our site, I want to see them back but some of the behaviour back then was unacceptable. Within reason, I will now allow you the last word.
Mr Shinerock – there is very rarely something that can be called "an original idea" – and I have never claimed yet to have had one. But at the end of the day every opinion is based upon a number of factors – and it is those factors – or the interpretation or perception of them – that are the cause of debate here, I would suggest.
"Sadly the only articles currently getting significant posts relate to AM and this currently flatters this pub." Funny, that – as EXACTLY the same can be said about the other pub…!
Another point to make on your comment "Sadly the only articles currently getting significant posts relate to AM and this currently flatters this pub.", Mr Shinerock. I draw your attention to an article halfway down the page from this one – http://www.propertyindustryeye.com/civil-aviation-authority-warns-agents-illegal-drones/ NOT, you would expect, likely to attract much by way of reaction – especially when we've all been so caught up in this article today. Ahhh… but that isn't the case, Sir. 19 comments today half of which have to be exact – which, by the way, is 48% MORE than ALL TEN articles on EAT's front page have amassed – and half of those have been there since YESTERDAY (without so much as a single word posted…)! No wonder you like to frequent THIS pub, Mr Shinerock – the boredom must be killing you in your own snug! ;o)
"But coming back to the Landlord issue, firstly I am not the Landlord, or shouldn't be…" No – I would liken you more to the brewery. The poor Landlord is tied to serving whatever pint you tell him to pull…
"…and secondly, you were all going to follow Ros anyway, at least for a while." REALLY?? Why? Because we felt in some way sorry for her, maybe? Think again. But when you do, REALLY think – why such a large percentage of EATs ever-present 'regulars' moved to the pub down the road… and why now only some of them pop back once in a blue moon for the occasional swift half.
"Feeling generous, Paul H – or has Mr Shinerock posted something… a 'first'… that you are actually prepared to agree with? Spill the beans, Sir! ;o)"….Oh I didn't realise that you had to agree with a post to 'like' it! If his after the record for most likes let him have it, as long as his not expecting an award!
"….Oh I didn't realise that you had to agree with a post to 'like' it!" So – the whole point of 'Liking' a post is… WHAT, exactly?
"….Oh I didn't realise that you had to agree with a post to 'like' it!"….I thought they were to make your own comments appear popular!
Well… it does appear to be a popular use of the feature…
37 Likes!…..the word tragic springs to mind.
Currently stands at 51, RealAgent – but AT LEAST one of those 'Likes' are from someone who doesn't actually 'Like' the content in the slightest or even agree with it for that matter – just wanted to help Mr Shinerock hit his target… crazy as crazy can be!
"but AT LEAST one of those 'Likes' are from someone who doesn't actually 'Like' the content in the slightest or even agree with it for that matter – just wanted to help Mr Shinerock hit his target… crazy as crazy can be!"…I've double clicked on the 'like' button for most of Benay's posts today tho!
Simon, how about donating a quid for agents giving for every "like" you get for your first comment here today! go on…..you get an unassailable "likes" record that would become folk lore in years to come on this forum!!!
Great idea, too late now, another missed opportunity
By the way, I'm really really sorry I offended all you uber posters and I promise if you come back to the other pub once in a while, I will do my best never to offend you ever again, pretty please 🙂 There you are, I have no shame.
Mr Shinerock – I said you SET OUT to offend… I certainly didn't give you the pleasure of saying you achieved your aim. ;o)